Hello, members,
It’s Paul:
Here is something that I’d allowed to go missing for a good while, only to find a typed copy on a memory stick, thankfully.
It concerns a 1969 article from ‘The People’ regarding Jestyn Austen Plantagenet Phillips, who set up a boat club for local young children and youths. But the rule was for misbehaving or breaching H&S regulations, was the the cane, during the earliest days of the club, and later a homemade paddle.
It little bit of background that i Find on this gentleman:
Jestyn Reginald Austin Plantagenet Philipps, 2nd Viscount St Davids Bt, (19 February 1917 – 10 June 1991) was a British peer, the only surviving son of John Philipps, 1st Viscount St Davids, and his second wife, Elizabeth Philipps, Viscountess St Davids (née Abney-Hastings).
At the age of 37, St Davids was forced to sell Roch Castle after his company, which provided canal barge pleasure trips on the Regent’s Canal, went bankrupt.
While sitting the House of Lords, St Davids accepted the Labour Whip, although he later described himself as a convert to Thatcherism.
While serving in the Lords, St Davids opposed restriction on immigration. He is also notable for being the first person to raise climate change in the houses of parliament, in 1969, over a decade before it was next mentioned[2]:
“My Lords, can my noble friend say whether he and British Railways have taken account of the fact that what were abnormal temperatures last summer may not be abnormal if we continue to discharge carbon dioxide into the air by the burning of various fossil carbons, so increasing the greenhouse effect?”
St Davids founded a pirate club in Camden Town, which was designed to give children a chance to spend time on boats.
Article enclosed on Word attachment, as well as a photograph from his younger days.
Thank you,
Paul
Spanking kids at the boat club The People, London, 9 November 1969.docx (26.5 KiB) 6
download (1).png (455.08KiB)
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Another_Lurker
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Apr 28, 2020#2
Hello Paul,
Most interesting! But I see nothing untoward whatsoever. We are talking about 1969, over 50 years ago. As you yourself point out at the end of the transcript, SCP was still fairly widespread in schools and accepted as a normal disciplinary measure by most adults and children. There is no suggestion that his lordship was up to any naughtiness when spanking, paddling or caning boys or girls.
Parents and other adults on the club’s committee were aware of what was happening, as were the responsible local authority. Some of the committee and the local authority representative apparently had misgivings, but these seem to have concerned corporal punishment per se rather than any dubious goings on in the administration thereof.
The children themselves had probably been quite happy with the situation in the past, but seized by the spirit of the age, with movements like the National Association of Schoolchildren coming onto the scene, were now turning against corporal punishment. They don’t seem to have been complaining about how it was done, just that it would be better if it wasn’t done at all.
As for his lordship, well the aristocracy and the upper classes had always used and accepted corporal punishment of their sons (and indeed their daughters) on the grounds that it taught them proper conduct in life and made them tough enough to hang on to the many advantages the family had accrued over the centuries. He was quite possibly thrashed at home and almost certainly would have been thrashed at Eton. For him the use of CP would just have been the norm. However he was obviously a perceptive and socially aware man, so I doubt if he put up too much of a fight when the spanking had to stop.
The article in the press appears to try to attribute something sinister to the use of the paddle. Complete nonsense. It was a boat club. Paddles would have been very familiar to all concerned. And of course the paddle was the chosen disciplinary implement of the USA, widely admired in that era as the place where it was at, whatever ‘it’ was. But they’d kept the cane for major infractions ‘cos it was more British and it hurt more without doing serious damage. Just as is now common in the US, the corporal punishment was optional. A short sharp shock or a more prolonged and tedious alternative, in this case being restricted in doing something which was very much enjoyed.
All in all a newspaper with a left wing agenda looking for a chance to bash the aristocracy. And if that led to friction which deprived a large group of children of a much valued activity, well the Sunday People wouldn’t have been overly concerned.
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Sir John 2
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Apr 28, 2020#3
Hi Paul,
Thanks for posting that and jogging my memory. I recollect being a very surprised when I read the newspaper report back back in 69 as I had previous knowledge of the Regent Boat Club but had no idea of the spankings. Sadly I have very little further information which will be of interest to the majority of the members of this forum.
I think I first became aware of the existence of the Regent Boat Club circa 1965 at the London Dinghy conference. There I met some young teenage members (they were accompanied by their parents) at a talk relating to kayak building. The only mention of paddling related solely to that craft. I was also a “canal crawler” at that time, having for many years been a member of the Lea Valley Sailing Club on the River Lee at Tottenham honing up over many years the skills of racing a 9ft sailing dinghy up and down a very narrow waterway.
Regents Boat Club was a little unusual in that it was a youth club not operated by a Church. It also had its own substantial premises which comprised a Thames Lighter converted to communal areas. I did see the Barge but of course had no authority to go on board. I recollect that the club catered mainly for senior school children (approx 11/15 plus some younger siblings) most of which did not come from under privileged backgrounds; I believe the weekly “subs” were much higher than ordinary youth clubs.
Besides evening activities during the week members were in the fortunate position of being able to “mess around in boats” at the weekend under supervision and when there was no canal traffic. These boats were mainly 2 seater kayaks but there was a rowing boat or 2 and a small wooden 16ft sailing dinghy. This latter boat was actually donated to the club by an acquaintance . Sadly, from my personal knowledge of this boat the very fickle winds in the canal caused by the surrounding buildings in the Camden area would have made sailing it quite difficult.
In my youth I was a member of several youth clubs and at 17 was actually a youth leader. I have never ever been aware of any parents having to sign any forms to enable their offspring to join a youth club, least of all delegating the apparently unfettered right of corporal punishment …thinks..mainmast floggings! It may be of course that because of the high danger element of the on water activities, the club wanted every tool at it’s disposal to maintain discipline and safety. Whether it actually needed the written permission I am not sure but presume the club was covering it’s bases.
Thinks…. I know an interesting tale of a 14 year old Sea Ranger whose Captain considered she the right to deliver a very sound OTK spanking without requesting parental permission but I will save details of that for another post!
I completely agree with Another Lurker that there was probably no hidden agenda and his Lordship’s comment that “administering the spankings was a disagreeable task akin to cleaning toilets” may have had an element of truth. Any suggestion that trousers or knickers were take down or that the punishments were excessive would, I am sure, have been leaped upon by the press in their enquiry.
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pi0591
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Apr 28, 2020#4
The Pirates Club and Lord St Davids have already been discussed on Corpun, and I expect the information is still on that site. There is a rather obsolete website out there somewhere with plenty of happy memories and photos from the time, and scarcely a mention, if any at all, of the spanking rule. In absence of other evidence it may just be that he was a perfectly nice chap, perhaps a bit naive, with some obstinately old-fashioned values.
The club thrived for some years under the Noble Lord’s direction, and he did not discontinue the spanking policy following the 1969 news items – indeed there was no further public controversy until about 1973 or 74, when either Camden Council or one of the London local government bodies withdrew public funding for the Pirates Club – according to The Guardian at the time, “because of the rule pertaining to spanking”. So the membership rules still pertained at least until then.
Paul Robert Thomas refers to the club in his autobiographical blog –
A propos, I’ve not previously heard of the “National Association of Schoolchildren” – does A L mean the National Union of School Students ?
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neilmc32
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Apr 28, 2020#5
Gosh, I remember this first time around in 1969 and I’m afraid that even as a sixties teenager I thought there was probably something a bit kinky in it – certainly it attracted my attention! I mean, even I knew that it wasn’t exactly normal to get spanked at a youth club whatever might happen in school!
Thanks Paul for digging it out.
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pi0591
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Apr 28, 2020#6
This isn’t the site I was thinking of, but it gives a bit of history –
http://www.sailinglog.net/organisation/view/4791
(sorry – previously posted on the wrong thread!)
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Another_Lurker
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Apr 29, 2020#7
Hello pi0591,
Most excellent links.
If the statement in the blog by Paul Robert Thomas that you link is correct I am forced to question my initial impression that Lord St Davids was just a nice chap doing his best for local youngsters as it says that the punishments, or at least the over the knee ones, were usually with the children just in their pants, and I have the impression he isn’t writing in American English. And if as you say the Guardian indicated that CP was still in use in 1973 or 1974 despite the earlier complaints then that was not good. But it was all a long time ago and judgment by modern standards is sometimes as dubious as whatever is being judged may appear.
You are quite correct. I did indeed mean the National Union of School Students. When I were a lad children went to school and students went to college or university and I’ve seen no reason to change that view. ????
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Sir John 2
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Apr 29, 2020#8
Thanks very much for all the links. Very interesting.
I find the entry in Paul Thomas’s blog a little bit dubious and possibly, for reasons which are not clear, exaggerated .
I am referring to “children being spanked OTK ….wearing ONLY their pants” . I find it highly improbable that children would be stripped down to one item of clothing! Unless he is trying to say that there was only underwear covering the bottom. Also he states that the spanker was called “peg leg” and infers that he might have had one. I had gathered, from another article, that this was , in fact, a nickname given to Prince Charles when he visited with his leg in plaster.
Having said that a certain amount of unknown and not sure can add a little more for the imagination to work on and come up with likelihoods and possibilities.
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marathon8
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Apr 29, 2020#9
Hello, members,
Thank you all for you contributions, of which there were many of great interest.
A.L, thank you. My thinking is that ‘The People’ reported the story both flippantly and wittily, rather than in the way tabloids normally report spanking incidents, as if it’s the most crushing thing the world has known. It would not have been unusual to have seen a heading like:
‘The Shame of the Kinky Boat Club Owner.’
Sub heading: Pervy ‘Whacko Lord Spanked Boys with a cane and paddle…and girls, too.’
Thereafter, it would have been littered with half-truths and sensationalism. This report was breezy, flowery, almost.
On the face of it, as you say, he had done no wrong: the kids were happy, the parents were happy, well some were. But, the peer really was doing something wrong, and I note you had a re-think, due to the fact that he continued spanking until much later, coupled with possible, unproven clothing adjustments. Yes, it was 1969, at the end of a decade of great social change and attitudes. But not as far as youth club owners could lawfully whack kids. In fact, in such an era of great change, it would have been more serous an offence to do it during the 1960’s than in earlier decades. He really did ‘get away with it,’ no matter how light the punishments may have been. You may not physically chastise other folks’ children, and never have been, albeit for the fact that the odd copper might clip you round the ear.
But as I have said, the children largely accepted it, even preferred the cane/paddle to the loss of boat time or membership being cancelled. And parents, probably pleased to rid themselves of their noisy kids for a couple of hours, signed the CP agreement. But that did not put the peer in loco parentis, like teachers were.
The chap, a Labour peer, did much good within the community. He gave local kids, some from poor backgrounds, the chance to do something worthwhile after school and at weekends. Better than playing ‘Knock Down Ginger,’ ‘Kiss Chase’ or ‘Schools,’ like I did (Err, no, the boat club would not be preferable to the last two street pastimes of mine!).
I loved the article and I admire him for running such an excellent club, but it would have taken just one set of parents to have taken their child to the police and he would have been sunk.(NO PUN). Especially if a complaint had been from the parents of a girl.
When I first saw this article I thought it would be just boys who were punished. I was amazed to read he did have occasion to cane three girls who made nuisances of themselves.
I’m not at all going to even remotely suggest that the Lord was a spanko or a tad kinky or that it gave him pleasure. I think he used CP in the interests of river H&S, in the main. Perhaps one could argue that the English public school system did produce characters that did rather enjoy spanking or caning folk .
Pi0591 –thank you for an excellent piece. I found and read the page by Paul Robert Thomas. I read much of the website and it was charmingly written, funny in places, and most touching. Much of it reminded me of my own schooling and upbringing. I was saddened to read about the young girl who wanted to keep her baby and had to fight social serviced almost singlehandedly. Quite eye-watering, to be frank.
I’m surprised the spanking went on to circa 1974, when there were rumblings of discontent in ‘The People’ report. That he lost funding due to his continue with spanking, shows how risky his spanking policy was. End of The Pirates Club! Sad for the children at that time. Perhaps he had felt he’d had enough of running the club by that time, otherwise he surely would have stopped the spankings.
Sir John_ I agree, I don’t think he would have risked having kids drop their trousers. As I say, he was pushing his luck, as it was, as ‘Neilmc’ has alluded to, for spanking in a youth club during that era. I’m sure had the peer ordered Children to disrobe some kid would have spilled the beans.
Sir John, that you knew well the Tottenham River Lea area is most interesting. I knew it well. All changed now. Quite lush is the Lee Valley Park and the leisure and athletics centre. I recall the 233 bus down to Tottenham Marshes. 1961! Tottenham Hotspur and the double! The white bus coming down the high road with the two trophies…….trouble is, they’ve done jack all since!!!
More anon………..
Paul.
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Sir John 2
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Apr 29, 2020#10
Hi Paul,
Your post has caused me to reminisce a bit off topic. This was a great period of my life. Although I was never really a football fan many of my contemporaries were and it was difficult not to catch the atmosphere around White Hart Lane in 1961 with the successes of Danny B’s team.
I was in the 6th at school and forget the number of times( at least 3 times a week) then and over the previous years I drove past the grounds and over the railway crossing at Northumberland Park on the way to the sailing club at Stonebridge lock . By 1961 I was riding a 250cc BSA motor cycle but in previous years I would have been on my trusty Claud Butler racing bike and taking nearly an hour to do the trip from home.
For some reason I had placed you in a much younger age group than A L and myself but your mentioning the double has got me thinking.
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marathon8
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Apr 29, 2020#11
Sir John
65…
soon. Born in 1955
Paul
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hcj44
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Apr 29, 2020#12
Paul wrote:
“Yes, it was 1969, at the end of a decade of great social change and attitudes. But not as far as youth club owners could lawfully whack kids. In fact, in such an era of great change, it would have been more serous an offence to do it during the 1960’s than in earlier decades.”
I’m a little surprised by that. I haven’t done any search for written evidence, but I’m pretty sure there was some, relatively minor, whacking that occurred in the Scouts at that time. Indeed, I obtained a small paddle from the local troop, in return for a donation, well into the 1970s.
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marathon8
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Apr 29, 2020#13
Hello, Hcj44
Thank you so much and good to hear from you
To answer your point, yes, there were scout masters who whacked boy scouts. But they weren’t lawfully allowed to. That’s why some were thrown out of the movement and those who went too far were prosecuted. There were those, of course, who perhaps employed the use of a couple of moderate whack s with an implement to the shorts who might have gone undetected. But it would take just one complaint no matter how moderate to get into trouble.
I put a an incident on here about a year ago about a Salvation army captain who spanked girls. In the end, he went too far and was arrested.
Thank you, again.
Paul
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Another_Lurker
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Apr 29, 2020#14
Hello Paul,
Blimey, I didn’t realise I was dealing with a mere teenager! ????
You may well turn out to be right, but I don’t recall any particular statutory ban on any adult spanking any child while the spanking per se was legal, provided that the parent or guardian had entrusted the care of the child to the adult concerned. There might well have been a case to answer in such cases but my impression is that it would have had to depend on rather more than an all encompassing ban.
Can you quote any particular statutes, or any case law to support your claim please?
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Sir John 2
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Apr 30, 2020#15
Hi Everybody
This thread does seem to have taken off.
I suspect Scout leaders may have be tempted to deal with miscreants in an old fashioned way but in the 60’s they had to be very very careful. As I understand they were under strict instructions to avoid any unnecessary physical contact with the boys. Sadly this was because there were/had been too many dubious individuals in the organisation who had a somewhat hidden (sometimes non so hidden) agenda regarding their young male charges. However I do recollect hearing stories of apparently fairly innocent “slipper games” at camp.
I can however report that in the summer of 1962 one 15 year old Sea Ranger received an exceptionally sound OTK spanking from her Leader . This smallish group of mainly 14/15 year olds had a group membership of my sailing club and most Saturdays would with great difficulty launch their ponderous and heavy vessel into the River Lea .With 6 of them each manning an oar and another steering they would then row up and down the river whilst either the Leader or her second in command sat bold upright in full regalia as passenger. All the girls wore the sea rangers uniform of dark blue slightly baggy shorts with white shirts with epaulettes with blue jerseys in colder weather. They also got various basic seamanship lessons and I think got to go to camp. Never looked much like fun to me especially as they had to keep their old planked boat filled with many buckets of water to stop the planks opening and then bale it out every time they wanted to launch it.. I recollect they were called something like 4th Edmonton Sea Rangers.
Strictly speaking the girls were not supposed to mingle with other club members and were supposed to leave en masse after their activities were concluded and their officers were no longer around to supervise them although their second in command was actually a proper member who with her husband owned and sailed a boat at the club. But we were a very young club (85% of the active members were under 22) so it was inevitable that some of the girls started to hang around out of uniform technically as guests and several often came back on Sunday and crewed for some of the lads in races . I and others regularly took some of the girls out in our boats and tried to pass on knowledge.
Because of their ages and the fact that most of us were 2 or 3 years older it was all pretty innocent although I did occasionally threaten, as was my way, one or 2 of the cheeky ones with a smacked bottom. In the event the Leader beat me to it. Some of the girls were far from shy and had a schoolgirl smutty sense of humour. The young Lady of whom I write was forever teasing me with considerable innuendo about whether my “gears” were still working OK . I had actually had some issues with my motorcycle in the past. Her name was Carol and for those who like these details she was blond ,possibly a little on the short side and very slightly overweight. She was definitely the clown of the group and had a lot to say for herself. Apparently Leader , a very well spoken lady in her mid 40s had threatened her on more than one occasion to put her across her knee for a jolly good spanking. I don’t think the girls believed her but they were wrong.
There is actually not a great deal to say about the spanking. Saturday was usually not that busy at the club. Whilst it was taking place most members who were there were out on the water including me. Several people heard it however and it was no secret. Seems Carol was given a good talking to and offered expulsion from the Rangers or a jolly good spanking and a chance to improve her behaviour. She opted for the latter and this was carried out in a storage annexe at the rear of the club with Barbara the second in command standing guard at the doorway, there was actually no door. I knew Barbara and her husband quite well ,she was only a couple years older than me . She told me “Leader really gave it to her….I was gob smacked when she pulled her shorts down..drawers as well” On questioning the young lady at a later date I was informed that it had really really hurt, far worse than any slippering she had got at school and she had difficulty keeping tears at bay. I recollect suggesting , remembering punishments at my junior school that had she reacted a bit more instead of trying to be the tough guy she might have got off lighter. Carol never changed her cheeky ways much around the club I still sometimes threatened her with a smacked bottom but never did…probably Leader was a hard act to follow. She was probably less of the class clown around Leader., whom I suspect gained a lot of respect from the incident, which was never really discussed after it happened.
At the end of that summer the club had to move premises further south . The Rangers did not come with us and found alternative storage for their boat. Sadly I gathered from Barbara that the boat was severely damaged by a local street gang and the group disbanded. A couple of the girls actually joined the sailing club; not Carol. One eventually married a club member.
Not that great a story and strictly a little off topic but I thought it worth posting. Sorry about my tendency to dwell on my activities as a youth.
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marathon8
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May 18, 2020#16
Hello, A.L,
I hope all is well with you.
Spot of writing for me the last few days for LSF. Back to it quite soon!
Regarding the ‘The Regents Boat Club’ paddlings/canings administered by Jestyn Austen Plantagenet Phillipps, it would be under the offence of assault, occasioning actual bodily harm or in some case indecent assault. I haven’t independent copies of legislation regarding the physical chastisement of children carried out by people that are not the parent or teachers, who, were protected by being in loco parentis. But it’s a matter of basic common sense. I’m afraid to say, as much as I admire Jestyn Austen Plantagenet Phillipps, he would not be afforded the same rights as a teacher. He would have not had any legal right to chastise those in his care, whether the parent agreed that or not. I would guess that there might have been more of a chance of getting away with it during the 1960’s as opposed to, shall we say, the 1970’s or 1980’s. But he was lucky that those who did complain did not take it further.
We know that a policeman could clip a kid round the ear many years back, but I wonder at what point that was covered by law.
It’s like the situation of private tutors. In which era were they legally permitted to chastise the children they were tutoring? Probably never. But some did it and I admire them.
Next thread coming up!!!
Thank you, A.L
Paul.
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Another_Lurker
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May 19, 2020#17
Hello Paul,
My apologies, I almost overlooked this thread.
I am fine, thank you. I trust that you are too.
Glad to see that you are back hard at work writing for the Library of Spanking Fiction. No tales of a schoolboy scared of highly averse to SCP caught out in some transgression and shown the error of his ways while at the same time being liberated from his fears in the course of a caning by a very attractive but very strict young schoolmistress I suppose? No, I thought not. I only put that bit in for KK’s benefit! ????
I note your comments on the query I posed in my post #14 in this thread. I still think that in the day if the parents consented to their children being whacked and if there was nothing overtly disturbing or unusual in the way the whacking was conducted then someone in a legitimate role in charge of children would have been very unlucky to be hauled into court for their activities. The suggestion that children were whacked over their undergarments if true would I think have possibly triggered the ‘disturbing or unusual’ alarm, but that came from only one source if I recall correctly, and there may have been some confusion on the point.
Happily there is now no doubt on the issue. In the UK even parents cannot whack children with impunity, and a darn good thing too on the whole, though some may feel that there are exceptions!
Take care! One day all will be well with the world again – although I do note some slight backsliding from that view on the part of some realists experts!
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marathon8
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May 19, 2020#18
Ah, A.L,
Now then, now then.
Funny you should mention the genre of F/M fiction. There has been quite a surge of such works on LSF of late. And the readership seemingly appreciate it more so than my school M/F serial. My ebooks sell well, but I fear the interest in ‘school’ is deminishing! But so is M/F.
Which clot on here was carted off to hospital a week ago because he fainted while in the queue at the supermarket?
YEP! Me! Paramedics came out and whisked me away. ECG in the ambulance and my heart was beating at 47bpm which as the paramedic said is excellent, but then they noticed a problem. The rhythms were fluctuating and on went the the two blues and they sped me to A&E. I was petrified! Then worse came: another ECG and I wss taken to RED emergency, for such rhythms, I was told, can lead to a heart attack. Then it was a blood test, chest x-ray, blood pressure and my thinking was, ‘goodness, no more A.L for me!’
Anyhow, about four ECGs and pressure checks later, and the passing of five hours, a cardio doctor told me such rhythms are consistant with distance runners and are not thought to be dangerous. FEWWW !
But they treated me like a king. I was given a meal and beverages, and was well pampered. And I was told, ‘Keep on Running’.’
Thumbs up to the NHS!
Paul.
P, S. Members and moderators. ‘Keep on Running.”(?) Wasn’t that ‘The Spencer Davis Group’ during those cane swishing, whacko schooldays of the 1960s???
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Another_Lurker
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May 19, 2020#19
Hello Paul,
Completely off-topic I’m afraid,but then the Forum has survived 18 years with a proportion of off-topic stuff so no harm done I hope.
First on a point of order: Don’t you mean F/m (my jocular request for a story of firm but fair physical correction of naughty but timid schoolboy by strict young schoolmistress) and M/f (what I presume are your accounts of naughty schoolgirls dealt with by firm but fair headmasters etc.) or have I misunderstood the customary codes?
I apologise for having to say ‘presume’ with regard to your accounts. However as you perhaps recall LSF refuses to talk to me (probably my browser and general security set-up I suspect) and unlike the works of another author here I don’t recall encountering any of your writings outwith the LSF defensive perimeter.
Of course if you should chance to write any F/M I’d certainly glance with a view to purchase at a salutary tale of elderly but arrogant male speeding motorist firmly but fairly dealt with by a young but dedicated WPC under the Minor Motoring Offences (Mandatory Caning) Regulations. So keep me posted! ????
Your medical misadventure. Join the club! I regret to inform you that you may belong to that small but select band of us whose physical characteristics are not exactly what the medical profession says they should be. Although they’ve stood us in pretty good stead throughout reasonably long lives said characteristics seem increasingly likely to land us in hospital unnecessarily as medicine changes from a profession that used lifelong experience and acquired skills to assess patients to a profession that relies entirely on tick lists.
I also spent an interesting day in hospital a few months ago. I was as certain as I could be that there was nothing wrong and it transpired that there wasn’t. I’d had the symptom that suddenly gave rise to concern by a nurse then a doctor during a routine appointment for something entirely unconnected with it all my life and it had never caused me any difficulties. But despite explaining that, things didn’t match what should be happening with a ‘normal’ person, whatever that may be. Major medical emergency, blue lights, sirens, lots of questions, tests and scans, and eventually nothing found – except that I still had the cold feet I’ve had all my life and which had triggered the day’s events!
What to do? Tell clearly concerned and trying to do their best medical professionals that they’re wrong and you’re right or comply with advice? Having done my best to explain why I didn’t think there was a problem I complied and I’d do so again I think. Mind you, I was pretty worried when the nurse giving me a long verbal test of some sort warned me that if I got any of the next batch of questions wrong I’d be in hospital overnight. I think she’d sensed that by that time I was getting a bit impatient to escape! Luckily ‘what day is it?’ and ‘who is the current monarch?’ didn’t prove too taxing!
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pi0591
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May 19, 2020#20
Just to add that, like A_L above, I think we should cut the Noble Lord a little slack. He evidently ran a successful, popular, healthy and socially useful activity. He was operating at a time when corporal punishment in schools and families was not in the least unusual; we should beware of viewing his activities through the prism of today. On the spot discipline and improvised whacking was surely not unknown in youth organisations back then. Children are not daft: if there had been either over-severe punishment or some sort of impropriety going on, they would have deserted the club in their droves, instead of which he had a waiting list. Didn’t they in any case have a choice – whacked or suspended? And they actually chose the former. It can’t have been medieval torture then. He had parents largely onside; – even those who expressed reservations about the spanking policy did so quite respectfully and politely.
Old-fashioned, eccentric, perhaps a bit of a ham actor, who knows? I’d say he deserves the benefit of any doubt.
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AlanTuringBletchley
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Unread postMay 19, 2020#21
Yes indeed; it was “Keep on running” by the Spencer David Group (with Steve Winwood). I have (perhaps — we’ll see!) added a file attachment.
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Unread postMay 19, 2020#22
Well, perhaps not. ????
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Another_Lurker
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Unread postMay 19, 2020#23
My sense of the proper order of things, where Alan Turing is my very greatly valued fellow techie on the Forum, invaluable on a great many topics, temporarily not posting much but hopefully back regularly one day, mean that I have to pretend that the previous two posts never happened! ????
I shall therefore break the habit of a lifetime and post a music file!
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WWT
Unread postMay 20, 2020#24
Another_Lurker wrote: ↑May 19, 2020
Hello Paul,
I apologise for having to say ‘presume’ with regard to your accounts. However as you perhaps recall LSF refuses to talk to me (probably my browser and general security set-up I suspect) and unlike the works of another author here I don’t recall encountering any of your writings outwith the LSF defensive perimeter.
Hello A_L. It’s a shame that you are unable to log onto the Library of Spanking Fiction. Posts such as those shown below that have appeared on the site recently, provide welcome relief to the endless references to punished cheerleaders, spanking waitresses etc. that we have to put up with on this other sites dedicated to corporal punishment. Obviously these are being quoted out of context and you would need to read the whole thread to fully appreciate their relevance to corporal punishment and the topic being discussed.
Today, 00:01
“Ad verecundiam” is the Latin language name for the fallacy of taking an authority figure on faith. It is a very dangerous thing to do. The ancient Greek philosopher Aristotle was the man who first identified the fallacy of ad verecundiam. Aristotle was a smart fellow. Unfortunately a lot of people during the centuries after him committed the fallacy of ad verecundiam in regard to the teachings of Aristotle himself. With the result that many innocent errors of knowledge which he made were perpetuated for centuries. Ironic!
Today, 16:21
I insist that determinism is dead wrong. And the alternative to determinism is not only indeterminism (the idea that there is no cause and effect in the universe), which is also dead wrong. The alternative to both determinism and indeterminism is volition – i.e. free will. Free will is not a contradiction of the law of cause and effect. It is a species of cause and effect. All (non-psychotic) human beings have free will – i.e. they have the power of choice. And the cause of their choices is their choosing.
Deterministic causation does however apply to cause and effect in other entities than human beings.
I cannot explain this philosophical point in more detail here since this is not a discussion forum on philosophy.
I do hope I haven’t broken any copyright rule by reproducing these posts from another site but I’m sure that the necessary action will be taken if these need to be deleted.
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AlanTuringBletchley
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Unread postMay 20, 2020#25
I’d just like to point out that the video in post #23 links to a file on youtube, whereas my (failed) attempt was to upload a video file from my own computer, as an attachment. (A different recording of the same song, as it happens.) Technically, therefore, my old friend Another_Lurker has posted a link to a music file, rather than the file itself. ????
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Another_Lurker
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Unread postMay 20, 2020#26
Hello Richard,
Your snippets from ongoing threads at LSF are most excellent. Reminiscent of the exchanges here in those happy, happy days of yesteryear when we had more PhDs contributing than you could shake a stick at and mere A-level students like me frequently felt intimidated and oppressed intellectually!
But are there any stories of schoolboys, naughty but frightened of SCP, being guided onto the path of righteousness and enabled to hold their head up high amongst their peers by being caned by a strict young schoolmistress? Or elderly and arrogant speeding male motorists who failed to note the recent changes to the age provisions of the ‘Minor Motoring Offences (Mandatory Caning) Emergency Powers Act’ and thus unexpectedly find themselves under arrest and en route to an embarrassing appointment with a strict young WPC and her cane? If so I may be prepared to relax my browser defences and again investigate membership. Better still of course if ‘strict young’ is preceded by ‘attractive but’. However this is entirely optional! ????
But seriously, far too many sites want to be able to manipulate your browser to gain information about you and your web activities which they can sell on for a not insubstantial financial return. Other sites don’t necessarily want to do this but give the impression that they do because of careless programming of their access routines. I would think that LSF is probably in the second category but to me they are all one and I don’t deal with them unless I really, really need to get in, in which case I look for a back door.
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Unread postMay 21, 2020#27
Hello Alan Turing,
Ah, I see I should have guessed. That is a technical area where your proven past expertise might prove invaluable. Presently I know of no way to upload a video to Tapatalk and make it playable embedded in a post. My experiments have been limited to the advice I gave Texasrules here and to a lesser extent in subsequent posts in the same thread.
As noted in that post MP4 format definitely works as regards uploading videos to Tapatalk. As you will probably be aware a very quick and convenient way to convert video formats is ffmpeg running in Terminal on one of your Linux systems.
